Liftback caught my eye

[drummingpariah]

Hey guys and gals, I'm looking for a little advice. I browsed around the forum a little looking for a list of common problems or things to look out for when purchasing a 1stgen. I've always liked the look of the 1stgen Celica (everything after it... not so much) but couldn't find any here in Cali at a decent price. Yesterday, I was to find one that's sitting in a lot rusting away. Right now it all looks like it's just California rust, so I'm not very concerned about it, but I haven't taken a good look.

I gave a call to the owners of the lot to inquire about its status and what kind of price they might take for it, and hope to hear back sometime this week. If/when I get to go check it out in person, what should I be looking for, and what's a fair price?

This is what it looks like as it sits (I just happened to be walking by):

[skeptic]

No image showing up for me.


Main things to look out for are rust, rust, and rust. The stock engines are pretty wimpy, but cheap to fix or replace so decide for yourself if you care about how well it runs. Interior bits can be hard to find. Unless it's been restored or restomoded, assume all the normal wear and tear things are going to need done, these cars are over 30 years old. Shocks, springs, brakes, probably clutch, etc. When I went looking, the two main things I looked for were little or no rust, and a decent interior.

As for price, that's a tough one. On the west coast they seem to be fairly inexpensive, sometimes under $1,000 for a fixer upper, to nearly $5k for a nicely restored one. Modified is anyones guess, there just isn't enough of them being bought and sold to really set guidelines.

[drummingpariah]

Thanks for the reply. This particular liftback looks like it stopped running one day, and the owner never fixed it. It may have been abandoned, sold, impounded... who knows. Assuming it does not run, I think I'll make an offer of $400 or so, and go from there.

My plans would then progress to getting it on the road. My plan would start as:
13b or 13b-rew engine (mazda rx-7 rotary, turbo if available)
independent rear susension (possibly from the spare 240z I've been vulturing parts from)
wide tires (what is the stock lug pattern?)
rust treatment (sandblast, wire wheel, then a coat of flat black)
possibly seats, steering wheel, and possibly shifter (my inputs are high priority)

Then it'll become my daily driver while I finish building the v8 for my 240z. Hopefully it won't be too much of a pain to get it BAR certified, but we'll see where that goes when the time comes. Again, thanks for the reply!

[slowmo]

Like Skeptic said, rust is the main enemy. Since you are not concerned with the engine and drivetrain, the body and interior is your concern. Interior pieces are HARD to come by. Center consoles, plastic taillight covers for the hatch area, etc. 30 year old rubber seals tend to go bad, so look for rust under the carpet in the front floorboards. Also, look under the spare tire in the hatch to make sure you have a floor there. Sometimes the hatch will leak and standing water will cause the spare tire well to rust all the way through. The mechanical stuff is EASY to find. It's the piddly stuff that nickel and dimes you to death.

[drummingpariah]

It sounds like this Celica has a lot in common with my '73 240z. I'm not afraid of using a welder if the rust does punch through somewhere, and I'm not concerned about keeping the spare tire well stock (I could just weld some sheet metal in its place). The interior will probably end up being gutted, but I've always been a fan of stock dashboards. Are there any newer model cars that the dashboard can be taken from without too many fitment issues? I may even end up taking an RX7 dash, if it isn't too wide.

I'll be sure to get some pictures of it if I end up getting it. In any event, this has sparked my interest in a serious way. Even if this particular Celica doesn't come through, I'll be paying visits to a few that I've seen on Craigslist.

[slowmo]

Dashboards usually fair pretty well. The pad on the top will crack many times. They sell fiberglass covers for those that look really nice. The center console between the two seats is the part that many times are hard to find. I suppose you could make one if you are handy.

If the car is a california car, I would image it wouldn't be rusted too bad.

[skeptic]

Hey guys and gals, I'm looking for a little advice. I browsed around the forum a little looking for a list of common problems or things to look out for when purchasing a 1stgen.

My plan would start as:
13b or 13b-rew engine (mazda rx-7 rotary, turbo if available)
independent rear susension (possibly from the spare 240z I've been vulturing parts from)
wide tires (what is the stock lug pattern?)
rust treatment (sandblast, wire wheel, then a coat of flat black)
possibly seats, steering wheel, and possibly shifter (my inputs are high priority)

I'm not afraid of using a welder if the rust does punch through somewhere, and I'm not concerned about keeping the spare tire well stock (I could just weld some sheet metal in its place). The interior will probably end up being gutted, but I've always been a fan of stock dashboards. Are there any newer model cars that the dashboard can be taken from without too many fitment issues? I may even end up taking an RX7 dash, if it isn't too wide.

I'm a bit ... You ask for things to look out for, but it sounds like you don't care much about rust and want to replace pretty much everything else.

BTW, a pretty ambitious project, I'd love to see you go through with it. I'd be really curious to see what you do with the interior, assuming by gutting it, new seats, dash, daily driver, etc. you mean pulling the stock interior and replacing it with a custom one, possibly using parts from other cars. I want to do something similar, but as of yet I don't really know exactly what I want to do.

[WIQDTOY]

i see you're from the Bay Area. are you a fabricator by trade?

if you're set in obatining a liftback then yes, the Datsun 240Z's do share the same problems as the 1st gen Celica liftbacks. in fact, most Japanese cars from the 70's era did not have good metal body panels to begin with. couple that with body seams that pull apart in time and drainage holes that become plugged in time... you see a lot that will have rust in the common areas.

but, yeah, keep searching. there's always one to be had in ads and in front of people's driveways. they come up up here and there. but it seems that your not too picky and you're not afraid of rust repair.

you should be able to find one to your liking in no time.

[drummingpariah]

I'm a bit ... You ask for things to look out for, but it sounds like you don't care much about rust and want to replace pretty much everything else.

BTW, a pretty ambitious project, I'd love to see you go through with it. I'd be really curious to see what you do with the interior, assuming by gutting it, new seats, dash, daily driver, etc. you mean pulling the stock interior and replacing it with a custom one, possibly using parts from other cars. I want to do something similar, but as of yet I don't really know exactly what I want to do.

Well, I wasn't initially planning to replace the whole interior. If the stock interior is anywhere near as difficult as the 240z, it's not worth trying to find a stock one (and not worth taking a stock one away from someone who really cares about it). I can get something else to fit instead.

i see you're from the Bay Area. are you a fabricator by trade?

if you're set in obatining a liftback then yes, the Datsun 240Z's do share the same problems as the 1st gen Celica liftbacks. in fact, most Japanese cars from the 70's era did not have good metal body panels to begin with. couple that with body seams that pull apart in time and drainage holes that become plugged in time... you see a lot that will have rust in the common areas.

but, yeah, keep searching. there's always one to be had in ads and in front of people's driveways. they come up up here and there. but it seems that your not too picky and you're not afraid of rust repair.

you should be able to find one to your liking in no time.

I'm a web designer by trade. Cars are just my hobby. I just moved out here from the Boston area, where 70's cars just don't exist because they've rusted away to a set of tires. Even finding an early 90's civic out there was nearly impossible, and you'd be looking at welding in new quarter panels and rockers in a GOOD shell. From what I've seen, that just doesn't happen out here in Cali. The worst I've come across are collisions and hack jobs (where someone 'repaired' or modified a car in some irreversible way).

If this Celica does end up coming through, I'll sell my daily driver CRX and get the Celica running as soon as possible so I can button up the 240z project, then go to town with a modernization project on the Celica.

I'm really excited about the prospect of a small, light muscle car, and this has the styling cues and engine bay to make it happen. Coupled with the spare r180 I have and a proper IRS suspension setup, I don't see many reasons this won't be a great daily driver and weekend track warrior. The more research I do, the more a rotary engine seems to fit the car. Has anybody already installed a 13b or 20b? I'd be interested to see how it fits, and what kind of front/rear weight ratios you'd end up with.

[Andy_Vang]

Welcome! There is a liftback, the owner goes by Rotary_Celica I believe. Check in the Celica project section.

[drummingpariah]

He went pretty balls-to-the-wall with it. I'm impressed. I don't think I'd go crazy with a mix-and-match (partly because of smog, partly because I'd rather just have one manual with which to learn rotary engines). Instead I'm going to keep my eyes open for a 13b-REW. Here are the wheels I have on my Z, which will be moved on over to the Celica as soon as the Z has its new shoes.

[Im jhun_hapi]

If u get a celica pre 75 u dont need to worry about smog. good luck on finding one. theres alot of good guys here Andy and Ray check out their rides ull be surprise ...

Rocky

[bobmilkman]

Nice looking Z, those were my second choice after the celicas when I was looking around.
If you go with a roatry for the first time, make sure you know all their problem points carefully, as they tend to be unreliable if not properly maintained and built.

[drummingpariah]

I bought a 76 GT Liftback yesterday.
Pictures here (since the last picture didn't show up):
http://picasaweb.google.com/Jesse.B.OBrien/Kaizen

All told, I paid $500 for it and it drove back on its own steam. I essentially showed up, looked around the body, checked that the lights worked, changed the oil and radiator fluid, put the full-size spare on it, and drove it the 80 miles back to my place.

So far, I've identified a few problems, but I'll put them up in a Project thread.

[skeptic]

Pretty good deal for $500. Decent wheels for that price as well (a hot topic around here considering the stockers are pretty ugly). Not a fan of the automatic, but if you go through with your engine swap ideas you'll probably swap transmission as well and adding in the other bits for a manual should be pretty easy.

Overall I give it